Posts by Franklin Massey

23

So It Begins...

by TimothyT in

all i can say is lol!!!.

so... i have been outed... im gay, and at least one elder now knows!.

while i was at bingo tonight with jack i recieved a call from him.

You have progressed quickly since we first talked a while back. It seems that you don't feel there is a place for you in the Watchtower Organization. You may be right. If you're happy and confident of your decisions and the outcomes they will bring, then just proceed with your life and don't look back. If you don't want to remain a JW, then make a clean break, physically AND mentally. This type of situation has the potential to plague you for years - if you allow it to. You have the power to take control and leave it all behind.

If you find the rules of a certain group to be invalid, then don't worry about how that group will go about trying to enforce their rules on you. You don't play their game anymore.

If you find that you no longer want to be a part of a group because you can't conscientiously profess to believe their doctrine, then just walk away and let them sort it out.

_____

@yourmomma - You said, But in 50 years I think (hopefully) we may look back as a society and be like "wow, they did that to gay people" just like they look back at the civil rights stuff like "wow they did that to black people". I used that same line of reasoning in a group discussion with JWs when I refused to condemn same-sex marriage. They said, "But there is a BIG difference! We know it's wrong to be racist. We would never deny someone rights based on the color of their skin. We also know it's wrong to practice homosexuality." I said, "We're not talking about morals. We're talking about human rights. Just because someone chooses a different moral path than you, doesn't mean they should be excluded from basic human rights." They huffed. They claimed that comparing gay rights to the African-American civil rights struggle was unfair. They said that JWs stand firm in their standards, even if the morals of the world are in "decline." "God's standards don't change!" They said that JWs have always had this stance on homosexuality. I asked, "What if JWs taught that Africans were an inferior people and that when paradise came, their skin would turn white? Would you align yourself with that idea?" They said I was crazy! They said I was going out on a wild tangent to try to prove a point. I said, "Clearly, you don't know that early JWs used to teach just that. It was published in the magazines. You can look it up for yourself." They said, "Well, we used to celebrate Christmas too. They had a lot of changes to make." I said, "So you don't think that in the future, we may have to make changes on how we treat issues relating to gay people, similar to the way the had to drop the racist view of blacks?" No comments from that point on. I'm pretty sure none of them ever looked up the old magazines either. It's easier to write me off as being "too liberal" and an "independent thinker." The scary part is, if they are willing to let the WT Society do their thinking for them on gay rights issues, then they likely would have been a part of the civil rights problem back then too.

142

Undercover Brother Campaign- have you received your invite?

by stuckinamovement in

jw
friends

without specifics being mentioned as to what it is......(to avoid tipping off certain lurkers).. how many people know about the upcoming summer long campaign?

please use this thread to confirm receipt of your campaign invitation.

take care.

Franklin Massey

Please PM me.

37

Are JW EX elders in need of our contempt or sympathy ?

by eruption in

jw
friends

point 1. not so long i would have strung them all up and hanged them.. point 2. these guys were the real succers, not only did they become jw,s, they embraced and adopted the cults teachings, and to some extent subjugated thier familys happiness, and thier own,to elevate themselves, and achieve status and recieve privellages, ie not have a f-----g life.

point 3 they had the onerus task of making sense, of the ever changing (truths) and having to teach that crap to the rest of us, and cope with the subsequent questionings that would invariably follow.. point 4.they had to take the lead in (sales) distributing literature.

point 5.they were the authoritarian face of the society, and a lot of people, (myself included ) thought they were jumped up janitors and window cleaners with a chip on thier shoulders.

Franklin Massey

As a recently resigned elder, I'll weigh in, for what it's worth.

Point 1. Not so long I would have strung them all up and hanged them.

Ha! No comment.

point 2. These guys were THE real succers, not only did they become JW,s, they embraced and adopted the cults teachings, and to some extent subjugated thier familys happiness, and thier own,to Elevate themselves, and achieve status and recieve privellages, IE not have a F-----g life

I was born-in and heavily indoctrinated. I had to find out everything about the real WT Org on my own as an adult. Looking back, I do feel like a sucker. I never had the desire to "elevate" myself or "achieve status." I thought that my increased level of service was actually putting myself below my brothers and sisters. I had to work hard and put up with a lot stress induced headaches. Priveleges = work. I was happy to work for the good of the congregation.

point 3 They had the onerus task of making sense, of the Ever changing (Truths) and having to teach that crap to the rest of us, and cope with the subsequent questionings that would invariably follow.

This is where I began to have my conscience bothered. When I began deep research into the history and teachings of the WT, I became troubled with what I found out. I was personally responsible for teaching the JW doctrine, much of which I either didn't believe, or wasn't sure enough about to speak with conviction. This ultimately led to my resignation.

point 4.They had to take the lead in (Sales) distributing literature

For this, I'm sorry. I barely go out in the ministry anymore myself. As I was becoming more aware of the gap between my personal beliefs and those of the WT, I began to soften my approach in Service Meeting parts. I would cover the required material (featured offers, new procedures, start studies, start studies, start studies) and then always conclude by saying something like, "Maybe this approach is not for you. Maybe you feel that your abilities in the ministry may be different than suggested here in the KM. If so, find something you are comfortable with and work with that. We all know what we're personally capable of and should work within the boundaries of our own strengths and weaknesses." I had a lot of friends thank me for those words. It showed me how burdened some of the friends are by the constant push to do more and more.

Point 5.They were the Authoritarian Face of the Society, and a lot of people, (myself included ) thought they were ju mped up janitors and window cleaners with a chip on thier shoulders. (many are )

I'm a college educated business professional. I had no desire to be any sort of authority in the Org. But as much as I tried to avoid it, some people hear the title of elder and think, "AUTHORITY." This is another reason I stepped down.

point 6.Many of them are arseholes, but equally many really tried the best they could, under immposible circumstances.So to you guys. I tip my hat to you, I will never know you nor meet you, but I wish you well.

I can be a jerk sometimes. But I always tried to keep my jerkiness to myself, especially when dealing with congregational matters. You're right about "impossible circumstances." These positions should not be occupied my imperfect men. Unfortunately, imperfect men is all there is to work with.

30

LURKERS: Is JW the only true religion? Here is my personal research!

by mentallyfree31 in

jw
friends

are jehovah's witnesses the only religion teaching the truth?.

the statement that only jehovah's witnesses are teaching the truth is an extraordinary claim.

such a claim would require extraordinary evidence.

Franklin Massey

1pnt, I have a question about the group that you call "little flock," legal God chosen class," "remnant," and "144,000" that you claim is in our midst and leading this great preaching work of the Good News of God's Kingdom. How exactly are they leading? Do they all hold positions in the congregations worldwide? Do they all receive a special amount of Holy Spirit; more than an average JW publisher who is not part of this elite group? Do they all have a say in directing the work that is being done? Do they all contribute to the printed materials that are distributed worldwide? Do they all get to be part of the leadership selection process?

48

Waking Up From a 34 Year Slumber.

by alg1052 in

july 11, 2011 will be 34 years since i was baptised as one of jw's.

the sleeping pill i took was in the form of them providing the information that made the bible come alive with the truth and insisting that they go by the bible not adding or taking away from it.

i had negative experiences from local brothers from time to time, however i excused them as part of being imperfect.

Franklin Massey

Welcome. You mentioned:

I still attend meetings but find myself becoming more and more detached from the congregation as they appear to be in a hypnotic condition.

You are not alone. From the moment your eyes open, it becomes more apparent how many others eyes are closed. The meetings will become more of a challenge now that your perception has become sharper.

The problem that I find myself in that I see many others face is, Where else can you go? The scriptures direct Christians to keep associating with each other (Heb10:24-25). So I guess I will stay around until I find something better or until Our Heavenly Father Jah corrects the matter. I would like to add 1 additional point to my blog. The main reason that I have not left JW's is Matt 24:14. Who is known for preaching God's kingdom wherever they can?

Why do you need to "go" to any formal location or group? Base your life on the example of Jesus. He associated with all types of people, crossing over the boundaries of race, sex, religion and culture that so many people of his day allowed to divide them. That's why people found him so refreshing. He taught a brand of broad, principle-based spirituality that people could begin to apply immediately in their lives. Each person would apply it differently and if they were working on bettering themselves spiritually, then they would have no time to pick at each other's faults and worry about what divides them. My personal feeling is that at the moment Jesus was off the scene, his message began to be corrupted. Not that a man like Paul meant any harm. It's just that once churches began to be formed, the troubles began. Arguments over doctrine, morality, eating habits, circumcision, etc. What we call "Christianity" today seems to be a far cry from what the Bible says that Jesus did in the four gospel accounts. You acknowledged it yourself when you said, "If Jesus materialized and joined a congregation, he would probably end up disfellowshipped." The point is, Jesus probably wouldn't join any church or congregation anywhere in the world today. He would try to free people from the rules and restrictions of organized religion, only to be called a heretic and persecuted all over again. Which makes me wonder, JWs speak about how they can expect to be persecuted for adhering to Jesus' message and his command to preach. Do you think its possible that persecution could come from within the organization when a person like yourself notices un-Christian actions within the Society?

29

Why can't you ask questions?

by ihadnoidea in

i know that some will disagree on this, and say you can ask questions.

yet, i ask you to honestly think what would happen if you openly started asking questions on jw doctrine or evolution.

likely you would be made to feel like i did below if you started asking these questions to other jws.. .

Franklin Massey

Questions can be asked. However, where you stand in the JW organization, combined with who you ask the question of, decides the reaction you will get.

For instance, if you are a newer associate and you ask your Bible Study conductor why the blood doctrine has changed over the years, you'll likely be treated kindly and given the most recently printed info, along with the line that the Organization is so progressive and really has God's spirit in looking out for the people.

On the other end of the spectrum, let's say you are a brother who was born-in, a long-timer, in good standing, with elder or ministerial servant credentials. You ask one of your fellow "appointed men" why the Society is so wrong in its understanding and teaching of evolution. Red alert! You should know better! You're supposed to be an example to the congregation! How could you doubt the Society?!

Little children, extremely elderly ones, new members, unbelieving mates, Bible studies, poorly educated people, "spiritually weak" ones and the occasional congregation crackpot are usually allowed by the JWs to ask questions freely. The reason for this is because the JWs are so convinced that their understanding of spiritual things is far more superior than anyone elses. To them, you are just inferior in your thinking, a "spiritual babe" who is not yet ready for "solid food." It's quite condescending and arrogant.

Pioneers, born-ins, elders, servants, their wives, their children , long-timers in good standing and anyone else who the JWs think should know better are not usually free to ask questions that express any hint of doubt. These ones risk either alienating themselves as a threat to the congregation or, being downgraded to one of the lesser ranks (weak, crackpot) mentioned earlier.

This is just my observation. Would anyone like to weigh in on this analysis?

66

So..... are you apostates enjoying your mansions and private jets?

by Mr. Falcon in

jw
friends

a super-zealous elder once told me in a very grave tone, "you know, mr. falcon, when someone becomes an apostate and leaves god's organization, they usually do very well physically and materially.

" hence the reason he claims that they feel "vindicated".

now i do also remember hearing such statements in the past from other witnesses.

Franklin Massey

OTWO, you WERE bring materialistic! Don't you know that only Circuit Overseers are allowed to have Buicks?!

33

Amazing Awake Experience, Former druggie looks up JWs in the phone book and starts studying

by LostGeneration in

no looking up jws on the internet first?

and uses a phone book, who even owns a phone book anymore?.

here is the an "experience" from pg 7 of the august 2011 awake.. my teenage years were a blur of alcohol,.

Franklin Massey

I remember an assembly demonstration where a boy walked onstage with a Walkman and giant headphones, banging his head wildly. His father called out to him but the boy couldn't hear him. The dad walked over and removed the headphones and said, "Jonny, that music really has you excited. What are you listening to?" Jonny's response, "My favorite group, Rap City!" By the end of the demo, God made Jonny throw the tape away. A friend of mine from anouther circuit said that during their demo, the kid was listening to the heavy metal group "Kiss Death." Hahaha!

85

July 15th WT- Don't Research " False Stories " - Inspired by Satan !

by flipper in

jw
friends

i know the poster lost generation made a fantastic thread on this july 15th apostate article, however - i noticed some very powerful points on pg.

17 paragraphs 9 - 11 which weren't brought out that i feel needed to be touched on.

as was brought out in his thread this article told jw's to avoid apostates because they are " mentally diseased " allegedly and to avoid their web sites, not read their literature, watch t.v.

Franklin Massey

nugget brings up a good point:

It is a clever strategy to start from the premise that everything said by those who left the organisation must be a lie. It demeans them from the start and means that JWs will always have that mental perspective whenever they come across someone who has a negative view of the society. It makes me angry when I think of all those damaged by the society who have just been labeled irrelevant.

If you have experienced the merciless treatment of the religion and come here then you already know that the society is duplicitous but this article tries to stop those who have doubts from doing anything about it instilling fear and doubt. This article demeans this forum and is slanderous and they call themselves the truth.

Some of the horrible mistakes the Society has made (changing blood doctrine, early racism, Mexico/Malawi debacle, child abuse coverups, etc.) sound, to the naive ear, too crazy to be true. For instance, I would love to tell my family about Mexico/Malawi as I feel that they should know the real story, as opposed to the story of the little boy who kept praying for "Wally" and his parents finally figured out he meant "Malawi" and "my oh my how God helped those faithful souls"...anyway...Articles like the one that this post is about make it nearly impossible to reveal any of the heavier truths about "THE TRUTH" because loyal, subjective JWs will immediately dismiss them as wild demonic fabrications. "The Governing Body would never do something like that! Jehovah wouldn't allow it! Where did you hear this?!" And just like that, you are now an apostate spreading "false stories." It doesn't matter if the story is true. It doesn't matter how sincere and respectful you are in your telling of it. All that matters is that the Watchtower told them to look out for people like you.

66

So..... are you apostates enjoying your mansions and private jets?

by Mr. Falcon in

jw
friends

a super-zealous elder once told me in a very grave tone, "you know, mr. falcon, when someone becomes an apostate and leaves god's organization, they usually do very well physically and materially.

" hence the reason he claims that they feel "vindicated".

now i do also remember hearing such statements in the past from other witnesses.

Franklin Massey

I just saved 15% on my car insurance. Does that count?